Why Porn Sucks (Pun Intended)

As I look at my one-year-old who has yet to talk, but to whom I read stories about Mr. Brown and all the amazing sounds he can make, or about water water everywhere with the anthropomorphic octopus illustrating this truth, I think about how we humans inherently love storytelling. We crave narrative, real or not. In keeping with the wonder and fantasy of childhood, my wife and I have decided that we will tell our daughter all about Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. And I play with my daughter, pretending that her stuffed bunny’s dancing and talking to her, and even now, though she’s so little and cannot say so, I can tell that she understands that I’m making the bunny do this, but the idea that bunny could do it all on her own — my daughter loves it. We love stories and fantasies, and using our imagination — everyone knows this. So why do I find pornography to be so disappointing?

Few things are more fictional than porn. Narrative or not, pornography is all about the fantasy of an outrageous sex life, while most of us have fairly staid and uncomplicated relationships (sexual or not) with the other humans in our lives. Since the internet came along there’s been a burst (dare I say ejaculation?) of porn genres and subgenres. Largely gone are the traditionally plotted and acted pornographic feature films that were popular from the 1970s into the 1980s. Those old movies might serve better as warnings to aspiring actors of what not to do. Don’t overact, don’t stumble over your lines, don’t give empty, vapid performances to your speaking parts. The writing is not even worth mentioning, except to say that these films were typically built on full-scale premises and plots. They were actual fantasies.

For a while it seemed that what took the place of plotted porn was simply sex scenes by themselves, spliced together in a particular pattern of fellatio + (occasional cunnilingus) + intercourse in a variety of positions = money shot. You never saw how the “characters” ended up having sex with one another (or with however many partners). What mattered was the sex. I mean, pornography serves a basic purpose, right? Who cares about “story”?

But it seems that, since around the mid-2000s or so, the trend in pornography has been to mimic reality. Inherent in this facsimile of real life is narrative. The viewer has to see how the “characters” end up having sex and that requires a story. Take the Bang Bros. Bang Bus series of videos, for example. A porn producer/cameraman, along with a performer and a driver, cruise around LA in a windowless van, scoping the streets for beautiful — and solitary — women. They seem to stumble across one of these beauties and convince her to get in the van. They say they’ll give her a ride where she needs to go, or that they’re producing a college film and they want to ask her some questions. Once the woman’s in the van they slowly talk her into having sex with the performer and all this is “caught” on camera. There’s a variety of these so-called “reality” or “gonzo” pornographic films. There’s College Fuckfest where porn people go to college parties and have sex on camera. There’s Book Bang where porn people go on college campuses and talk a college girl into having sex on camera for money so that she can buy whatever.

Anyway, the genres aren’t the point; the point is that it’s painfully obvious in most cases that the people involved in the sex act in the pornographic film are far from amateurs and are certainly paid performers. For one thing, each production company would find itself in some serious trouble should it go around filming people having sex without first getting said persons’ written consent to distribute the images worldwide on the Internet or wherever else — and for compensation. On top of this logistical reality, there’s the fact that Los Angeles — or wherever — is simply not filled with people who are willing to have sex with complete strangers for money or not at the mere suggestion of such a situation. And this is all too easy to see in the performers’ “acting.” Thus, porn returns to narrative, but like in earlier eras the fantasy crumbles around the break in verisimilitude.

But like I said before: who cares about the story or the “reality” of the story? It’s about the sex, right? But here’s where I say that’s it’s not about the sex, really, at all. Sex is, of course, a wonderful, surprising, necessary, and meaningful part of life. But what makes sex so great is the fact that the person (or people) with whom you’re about to have sex are into you, and you’re into them. Like the sex act itself, 99% of it is the build-up. I’m not saying that every time people have sex they ought to be in love; I’m not even saying that when people have sex they need to “like” each other’s personality. But I would hope that when most people have sex they do so because they are attracted to at least the idea of having sex with that other person. And this is the part of the formula that pornography can’t seem to “nail.” No matter what the plot might be, or lack thereof, no matter how many different picking-up-girls-in-a-club-type scenarios pornographers invent, the performers do their jobs just like that: like jobs. No wonder it’s called a “blowjob.” You never get the sense that the people engaged in the leading-up-to or the sex act itself are doing so because they’re actually attracted to their partner or partners.

While I’m not advocating that people stop watching pornography — far from it, after all one of my friends, when I told her that I was writing this, said, “Sometimes you just want to see wieners” — I will say that if you’re looking for sexual gratification in life, you’ve got far better chances if you try finding other actual humans whom you like, and who like you back. TC mark

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  • guest

    i think this is a solid start to a much needed conversation about how we view sex now that porn has been so prolific and explicit in pop culture

    very well done! you go girl! <3

    • scrotes

      it’s a man

      • Sam

        AHAHAHAHA dying here.

  • scrotes

    you think too much about porn. i just think it’s disgusting. isn’t that enough for one to say porn sucks?

  • http://okweirdo.tumblr.com raymondthimmes

    I feel like you are coming from this from the perspective of a married man with a child. Much older and obviously much more mature than most. I feel as though porn, and I’m being super honest/oversharesque here, is honestly my only connection to sex. I grew up with it. Since I was about 13. (I turned 12 in 2000.) So everything you describe is basically my understanding of sex.

    I never get a chance to have sex. I don’t really know if it’s because I don’t “try” hard enough to get women to go home with me from bars or just that that it has so happened that I only ever sleep with someone I’m in a committed relationship with. Either way, watching porn is about my only connection to what you state is so necessary and healthy, sex. I know I am probably perpetuating the disgusting “male” stereotype of some weird guy in his room alone watching titties fly but really, porn has pretty much been the only thing that has taught me anything about human connection and sex. I don’t watch it all the time, and it definitely doesn’t consume my life but truth be told, it’s my connection to human sexuality. Unfortunately. I desperately want to meet someone.

    My point only is this: I can completely understand your unimpressed feeling towards the medium. You’re in a much more mature place, in a committed relationship with a kid. I envy it. Truly. Good piece, btw.

    P.S. Check out x-art if you are looking for something with fantastic camera work and sometimes a decent emotional connection between performers.

    • http://www.paolomaneli.tumblr.com Paolo Maneli

      When you said “Oversharesque”, all I could think about was Cher – you know, the singer. “Do you believe in love after loooove?”

      What a dark, dark part of my life…

    • Hry

      A nice exposition of the Y Generation’s attitude.

      Hasn’t amateur porn and the advent of tube sites been a very important development in porn-watching and a search for authenticity? User-uploads will generally be made by people who can stand the sight of each other. Who knows, some might even be in wholesome relationships – quite different from horribly exploited women on drugs to stop them feeling anything being abused by misogynistic male directors. Often the emotional connection is visible. They aren’t people doing it unwillingly to pay the rent the only way they can.

    • Amanda

      Being in a mature place, a committed relationship (especially if it’s been a long one) and having a kid, all of which apply to me, is exactly why we need porn. I went to see my doctor due to a declining sex drive and his first and most recommended solution: watch porn. Guess what? It works. So while some may see it as disgusting, perverted and whatever else, for me, it brought life back into my relationship. I can foresee comments saying that if you have a good relationship and you love your partner, you don’t need help in that department. To that I say, bullshit. If you have been having sex with the same person for a very long time, at some point you are going to need to spice it up.

      • Beeee

        I agree 100%!!! And I’m a woman!

  • http://www.itmakesmestronger.com/2012/08/why-porn-sucks-pun-intended-2/ Only L<3Ve @ ItMakesMeStronger.com

    […] Thought Catalog » Love & Sex Add a comment […]

  • random

    An all encompassing discussion about porn is just as useful as an all encompassing discussion about music these days. So very useful and enlightening. Autotune is destroying music as we know it, amrite?

    • Titty Twister

      nah, it’s just making it easier for people with actual talent to shine… music, I mean, not porn. If there were people with talent in porn, I suppose they would shine too though.

      • random

        You gotta work on your reading comprehension. We’re agreeing. Considering the fact that there’s so much good new music these days it would make no sense for a person to talk about Pitbull (who is wildly popular), make him represent music, and then write a ‘Why Music Sucks’ article that’s really about why Pitbull and artists like him suck. Sub in Bang Bros. for Pitbull and porn for music for the complete analogy.

  • G Nimo

    “I will say that if you’re looking for sexual gratification in life, you’ve got far better chances if you try finding other actual humans whom you like, and who like you back.” Erm, no – I assume you must be at least passably attractive to have made this statement. I am a 30 year old female virgin who has never been hit on. I could not give it away even if I paid for it. Before you make any assumptions, I do have a very active social life. I am just way too unattractive for anyone to ever want me. At least my hands won’t reject me.

    • Veronica

      It is indeed easier for attractive people to have sex, but nobody is way too unattractive for ANYONE to EVER want them. The heaviest woman in the world (or possibly second-heaviest) is married to a man who appears happily in love with her, which means you definitely still have a chance.

      To the article: Some porn actors do really appear to be attracted to their partners in the scenes. It’s great! (Which does support your point that what we’re looking for is the build-up, the story, the emotions.)

    • Emily

      Like the commenter above said, attractive people do generally have an easier finding sexual partners. But a lot of it has to do with putting yourself out there in the first place – I know I’m reiterating an old cliche here but confidence really does make all the difference. Obviously, this is far easier said than done – but by straight out dismissing the idea that anyone will ever find you attractive sleep with, you’re pretty much dismissing any chance it will ever happen. By being so defeatist, you’re shutting yourself off from people and making yourself come acres as unavailable. Not trying to lecture you or anything so sorry if I come across that way. I hope you can believe in yourself more – focus on the good things rather than the negative. We’re often our own worst critics.

      • Emily

        *attractive enough to sleep with, rather. sorry about that.

    • You = Awesome

      That’s your problem right there babe, change your mindset to how awesome you are, even if you don’t believe it right away. Look yourself in the mirror in the morning and tell yourself how fucking awesome and sexy you are every day. It works. Try it. A shift of consiousness is powerful.

  • Manasseh David

    Reblogged this on i'm manasseh david and commented:
    But here’s where I say that’s it’s not about the sex, really, at all.

  • Scott

    Ill disagree. I watch it for the sex, primarily because Im jerking off and don’t need to see said storyline. In fact, many times ill simply go through a number of clips, skipping forward 2 minutes intervals in order to see what I like. That act on its own makes me think that each scene contains a number of images which I found arousing and almost art like in a way. There are millions (billions?) of blowjobs to be found online, however, when its the right girl, and the right guy, in the right lighting and angle, it truly is a beautiful thing.

    Ill add the same to “real life”. Sometimes I see my partner in that right light, and angle, and it is, again, a truly beautiful (and sexy) thing.

  • A dude

    Reading this, I had the image of a man standing in front of an incoming wave–like the one at the end of Point Break–holding his finger up as if to make a point.

    This discussion will never happen in earnest with the overwhelming majority of porn consumers.

    Feminists–I’m not claiming the author is or isn’t one–may eventually succeed in their efforts to re-tool language and what ideas are permissable to express in public, but they grossly understimate the biological mismatch in sex drives between men and women. The most publicly dutiful White Knight Mangina will not give up his porn consumption–even if he somehow won the jackpot and managed to land a woman who eargerly gratifies his physical urges. He will lie about it and consume it in secret if he must, but he will not give it up unless it reaches the obvious addiction stage (and even then, it’s ‘iffy’).

    The sheer demand for porn dwarfs the imagination. From what (admittidly) little I’ve read of the positions opposed to porn, it mostly covers the outrage and percieved harmful effects on society (i.e. the perception of women as sex objects for male sexual gratification), but I don’t know if I’ve ever read a serious (not a “boo hoo! the privileged menz are horny and can’t get laid!”) discussion on WHY the demand exists in the first place. This is something that I think the opponents of porn just don’t get, and perhaps never will.

    If I famished, and my partner is just like, “meh, I could eat. If you want to eat right NOW though, first I’m gonna need you to jump through these hoops.” then I’m going to resent it and look for a substitute. You may find the analogy crude and offensive, but I assure you it is not far from the sentiment of the endless waves of mongol hordes consuming porn. Attempts to dismiss the reality of our mismatched drives are likely to end in frustration–no amount of screeching outrage or piles of academic journals detailing the harmful effects of porn on women and society will successfully persuade the demand to go away. How do you convince a hungry man that he isn’t hungry? You can’t.

    Another thing I’d like to add, which I think would be beneficial to the readers of my comment even if you disagree with everything else I have written up to this point, is that it really has very little to do with the story or setup in a particular porn scene. Consumers of porn, myself included, do not give one shit if the female role does a passable job of acting like she desires the dudes fucking her. It does not matter. At all. I realize that this is just ANOTHER attitude for you people to moan about and label as problematic, but keep reading. What worries me is that porn consumption is slowly rewiring our brains, and not in a good way. There is a reason that the number of categories of porn has exploded over the last decade. I remember the type of porn that used to do it for me years ago–relatively plain vanailla sex, preferably with the woman wearing tan nylons–and what it takes me now to get that same arousal. I have to watch some pretty sick shit; shit that even I (a unapologetic misogynist who feels nothing but contempt for your people and your goals) think of as a problem. There are a few websites (that I’m aware of) that are starting to explore the long term effects of porn on the brain, and while I believe them, they aren’t credibly rigorous or academic.

    If I were someone opposed to porn on idealogical grounds, THAT is the avenue I would be using to make my argument against it. As I said earlier, whether you agree with my analogy or not, you are never going to convince a man that he doesn’t crave what he does in fact crave. You’ll also never sell him on the idea that consensual sex between willing and enthusiastic adults is worth “jumping through hoops” for when he could just watch porn and rent a girl when his finances allow it. But you MAY have some success convincing us that by taking a (poor) shortcut to sexual gratification, we might very well be ruining our ability to enjoy REAL sex on the occasions we might have access to it. Not on some silly (to us) grounds that porn distorts our perception of what normal, healthy sex should be, but on a neurological level–we just won’t be able to get aroused by anything but the most depraved (and unrealistic) scenarios.

    • Jack

      Ohh wow, look who didn’t see that the author of this article is a man. Too busy ranting. Don’t lump us all in with you, weirdo. Also, pointing out (several times) that you need seriously sick shit turns you on, makes it sound like you’re into underage stuff. So, I’d be careful about saying that.

      • A dude

        “Reading this, I had the image of a man…”

        Also, men can be feminists.

        Ignore the warning of my last paragraph if you want, but I wouldn’t recommend it. My tastes aren’t illegal, but they have drifted very far from where they started. The websites I mentioned are full of testomonials of dudes talking about how the exact same thing happened to them.

      • Jack

        Right, so therefore you have the ability to speak for all men, everywhere? No. Just because you, and people who are accessing the same sites as you think like this (obviously they’re going to say the same as you aren’t they?) doesn’t mean every single man is like that. Of the 3.4 billion men in the world, I’m pretty sure you guys are in the minority. So, dont presume to speak for us all. Also, you don’t need to so vehemently defend porn, don’t worry no-one’s going to turn the Internet off, or ban porn, so you’ll still be able to get your freaky kicks. This guy was simply asserting that watching other people have sex isn’t as good as having sex. Chill.

      • Jic Magger

        Speak for your self buddy. I’m a straight, mid twenties guy and my porn consumption (such as it is) consists almost entirely of softcore and has for years. In fact, I find most hardcore pornography gross and unsexy for the exact reason Jamie mentions in the article: the actors largely don’t appear to be into each other. It’s a constant focus on genitals and fluids with no human element.

    • Hah

      LOL at you.

    • Domino

      “I, an unapologetic misogynist” …. you just de-valued everything you just said. EVERYTHING.

    • Molls

      Have you ever gotten a woman with a soul to sleep with you? If so, I’m guessing it is gone now. Enjoy your “sick shit” though, dude.

    • TUP99

      I agree with what you are saying Dude, but I don’t think you and the author are necessarily opposed in your beliefs (at least not where the article is concerned). I believe that a lot of the author’s complaint is that sex, as it is portrayed in most pornography, is so mechanical and mundane, as to be boring and unstimulating. I didn’t get the feeling that the author was saying that pornography was wrong, or that people were wrong for watching it. Rather, I got the feeling that he was saying that we can do better.

      Now, whether the arguments the author gives for saying that “we can do better” are accurate is a whole other story: I personally think that better porn, and good sex in real life, aren’t really mutually exclusive. I also think that the author underestimates SEVERELY how hard it is for many people to get good sex in real life. He speaks as though it’s as easy as simply turning off your TV, going to the bar, and chatting a woman out of her panties. The sexual atmosphere in this country is FAR more dysfunctional than that, for a number of reasons, among them being a) we can’t have a serious conversation about what sex is and isn’t, and b) we can’t have a serious conversation about rights and responsibilities in the age of “sexual freedom.”

      Now on this Dude, I agree with you 1000% in blaming the Feminists: by creating a society where everything is women first, they have set up a situation akin to the famous quote from Catch .22, wherein it becomes crazy for anyone to think of anyone other than themselves. Your average woman has more sexual power than your average man: that is a fact. In nature, this is balanced out in that the male does not need to rely on the herd as much, and is more capable of coming and going as he pleases. In a perfectly sexually free society, women would have all the sex they want with all the men they want, and the men would get sex when they could, but not have to be tethered down to a family or group. In the society we had pre feminism, marriage was the ideal atmosphere to have sex in. In this arrangement, a man has a wife, and in return for providing him with children, and access to the children, as well as agreeing that she would take herself off the open breeding market, he devoted his time and energy to her and his “mini-herd”, and relinquished the right to simply wander off when the situation no longer pleased him, as he would in nature.

      Now I’m not going to say that this was perfect, that there were no problems, or any of that. However, in general it worked. With Feminism, women demand total sovereignty over their bodies, usually based in natural law: just as possession is 9/10ths of the law in human law, so in nature would you expect that a free entity can do what it pleases with its body if it is able. This in itself isn’t unreasonable, until you get to the point where they also demand that the law step in and make men honor the institution of marriage in everything but name and living location.

      This is where the whole situation breaks down: by allowing women to do whatever they want, while restricting men in their ability to respond, you create a situation where the cost of sex is so high that it is not worth seeking in real life. Even an average woman can get a seed donation from an alpha male. The same generally can’t be said for average men and alpha women. Now, in a true free-sex society, a beta man and an average woman could have sex, while, unbeknownst to the beta man, “his” woman has been impregnated by an alpha male. The beta can choose to stay or go as he pleases in this situation, and the woman can use her sex to continue to get favor from males. In a marriage based society, a beta man can walk away from an average woman impregnated by another male, alpha or no, but only if she was in fact impregnated by another male. There is some small guarantee there that sex he has will benefit him, and that she will be penalized if she has sex outside of the relationship.

      In the current situation though, an average woman can go, get pregnant by 4 or 5 different alphas, come home to her beta, and when her beta discovers the trickery, she can then divorce and take him for OVER half of his worth, to support seed that isn’t even his. Similar things can happen to men who think they’re having one night stands, men who think they’re having meaningless flings, etc etc. Women can use their sexual power to go shopping for men, and then lock a guy down in a situation where he basically loses everything.

      Now, between that, or masturbating to a porno for 10 or so minutes, what would you rather have? Yeah, there you go – yeah with a porno you can’t be hugged, kissed, caressed, and all that jazz, but given all the crap going on in the sexsphere, is it even worth it? Generally, no it isn’t, and in this Dude, I agree with you: it never will be worth it until we can actually have a serious conversation about sex, something that I doubt will happen with the responses I see below.

      • http://gravatar.com/lesort olivia

        So I feel like there’s an attempt at logic in what you just wrote, but I’m so appalled by your belief that feminism is the ‘problem’ that it’s incredibly difficult to try to tease anything rational out of it.

        You’re saying that women shouldn’t have sovereignty over their bodies, clearly – well then, who should? Men? Why? The crumbling of your so-called pre-feminist ‘marriage culture’ is only a problem if we’re presupposing that women shouldn’t have control over their bodies. Sure, if women’s bodies should belong in part to their men, having multiple sexual partners poses lots of seemingly irreconcilable issues – but even then, if and ONLY IF the ‘beta’ male partner continues to feel entitled to ownership of the female in question (and their progeny, which is a more sensitive point that I don’t much care to tackle here).

        So the problem isn’t that women suddenly up and decided to take control of their bodies. The problem is that people like you stand helplessly by, unable to comprehend a new kind of sexual relationship based on mutual understanding, respect and consent. Does feminism automatically imply that women will philander around, getting themselves impregnated left and right, all while choosing to maintain a more or less conventional legal and financial relationship with a man they can strip of his financial stakes in the relationship at any given moment? Um, no. As a (female) feminist, your totally incorrect conception of this movement quite frankly pisses me off. Want to know what feminism is? I know I won’t be able to accurately encompass the swath of concerns covered by the ‘feminist’ umbrella here, but I’ll do my best:

        Feminism is about empowering women to explore their human rights to autonomous and fulfilled life experiences, experiences including but not limited to pursuing a passion or career; having a family; finding (or not finding) a respectful, non-abusive and non-violent life partner of the sex and gender orientation of the individual’s choice; and seeking out safe and consensual sexual relationships that may or may not exist within the traditional paradigm of monogamy. I don’t see how this entails or even suggests that feminist women are all ‘freewheeling’ hypersexualized people destroying the balance of the “sexsphere.” Feeling morally okay about multiple sexual partners and having access to information about safe sex is a very important part of the feminist agenda as I understand it, but these tools don’t always result in the kind of situation you described above. It seems to me that differing expectations and a lack of communication in sexual relationships leads to what you’re talking about much more reliably. The successful propagation of feminist values takes men as well as women – it absolutely isn’t enough for women to assert their rights while men continue to expect what your pet ‘marriage culture’ taught them to consider their heterosexual birthright. Everyone needs to reevaluate and retool their personal ideas of what romantic and sexual relationships require, and I believe this needs to a happen on a relationship-by-relationship level.

        I know this is super tl;dr/whiny/annoying of me to insist upon but honestly, I don’t know what makes you a) think you understand what feminism even means and b) feel qualified to blame the (supposedly) degenerate state of sexual relationships in our contemporary culture on your totally misinformed opinions.

        <3 <3 <3 <3

        Oh also to A Dude: please don't assume that all men have equally heightened and frustrated sex drives while women lazily consent whenever they feel like it. Nope. Sexual preferences and sex drives vary dramatically from person to person and aren't necessarily tied to our contemporary gender binary. Have fun!

        <3

      • Jack

        Olivia, you are amazing.

      • TUP99

        [Quote]So I feel like there’s an attempt at logic in what you just wrote, but I’m so appalled by your belief that feminism is the ‘problem’ that it’s incredibly difficult to try to tease anything rational out of it.[/Quote]

        Of course you find it difficult. Like most people who follow systems of belief that aren’t based in any reality whatsoever, you simply cannot believe that someone has found a way that works that is not “the one true way” that you’ve been taught, and as a result, you simply must dismiss and denigrate them.

        [Quote]
        You’re saying that women shouldn’t have sovereignty over their bodies, clearly – well then, who should? Men? Why?[/Quote]

        When was this said? And I’ve been on the internet long enough to know that whenever someone can’t answer something you’ve said, they’ll answer something they wish you said instead, and not even be surprised about it, but still, did you just stop reading the reply? Maybe that’s part of why you couldn’t “tease anything rational out of it.” Responding requires reading.

        Ultimately, what was said by A Dude (as I understood it) was that porn serves as a substitute to satisify needs that men have, without the consequences of having to deal with the hassle and garbage that comes with dealing with most women. The original author says that you have better chances at sexual gratification with real people than you do with porn, and that is something that at least two people here disagree with. If I want to get off, right now, unless there is already a willing, able, ready woman sitting right next to me, you cannot present a better alternative than pornography, period. To sit here and say that free sex is a better, more accessible alternative, that sex in a relationship is a better, more accessible alternative, that sex in marriage is a better, more accessible alternative, is just ignoring what is going on out there, and what is out there (and what is wrong out there) starts with stuff like your basic inability to understand the basic difference between complete freedom and a contract, and why people will start walking away from one sided contracts once they see how one sided they are.

        [Quote]The crumbling of your so-called pre-feminist ‘marriage culture’ is only a problem if we’re presupposing that women shouldn’t have control over their bodies. Sure, if women’s bodies should belong in part to their men, having multiple sexual partners poses lots of seemingly irreconcilable issues – but even then, if and ONLY IF the ‘beta’ male partner continues to feel entitled to ownership of the female in question[/Quote]

        You don’t really believe that that’s the problem, and here’s why…

        [Quote] (and their progeny, which is a more sensitive point that I don’t much care to tackle here).
        [/Quote]

        It isn’t that much more sensitive: in nature, many males just walk off and leave their offspring, and the female does whatever she chooses with them. You want to say that a man should be responsible to them for 21+ years, but then you’d be implicitly admitting that I am correct: that straight up zipless fucking free wheeling sex is incompatible with the idea of parental and spousal responsibility. See, you balk at me daring to say that in a marriage, a woman shouldn’t be free to do whatever she wants with her body, but on a regular basis, we fine men who get married, and then leave the marriage, in order to pay the woman who has allegedly suffered a decrease in her standard of living. This is even if the female had no discernible skills at all, and the marriage was a step up for her in every way. As a woman, you are very much aware that if you are married to a man, you have say over him, his income, and who he has sex with (defacto ownership), and if he disobeys you on any of those, you can just walk and take it out of his hide. I don’t see very many women refusing to be married because they don’t believe in being able to penalize their man at will. I don’t see many women refusing to be married because they don’t believe in restricting their husband’s sexual options. It’s rather disingenuous of you (and feminists period) to claim that a woman has absolutely no obligations in a marriage, no restrictions whatsoever, however a man always has responsibility, and if he steps out that door, he is forsaking that responsibility, and must pay for it forever and ever.

        It’s stupid, it sounds stupid on the face of it, and it is: for a guy to sign up for a contract that the other party can break at any time, with no penalty to said other party, while they themselves suffer horrifically for it. A contract that basically says “you give up your freedom, I’ll take myself off the market, and we can build a life together…(until I change my mind at which point I’ll just put myself back on the market, and you can go back on the market too, after I take half your stuff).” If you so much as point out the absurdity of this, you will be equated with stone throwing Honor Killers who stoned a 13 yr old girl to death because she took her hood two inches off her head.

        [Quote]Feeling morally okay about multiple sexual partners and having access to information about safe sex is a very important part of the feminist agenda as I understand it, but these tools don’t always result in the kind of situation you described above. It seems to me that differing expectations and a lack of communication in sexual relationships leads to what you’re talking about much more reliably. The successful propagation of feminist values takes men as well as women –
        [/Quote]

        No, none of that is true. Look, I don’t know if the original author is a feminist or not, but if he is, then I will say that he is the FIRST feminist I have heard to write about porn without implying a) that all women in porn are forced, b) that there isn’t such a thing as a woman who enjoys taking her clothes off for men, and c) that there isn’t such a thing as a man who can look at a naked woman, enjoy a naked woman, while understanding that that is not all women, nor how that particular woman is all the time. Feminism has the libertarian’s problem: feminists state that they want women to be free to do whatever they want to do, however, when it becomes obvious that not all women want to do what said feminists want to do, suddenly there is a problem, and people need to be protected from themselves. As much as I may otherwise disagree with the author, I am amazed and pleasantly surprised that someone was able to present the bad points of porn without delving into the “masturbating to women is evil, and degrading to them, and insulting, and etc etc…” argument. If you were truly for successful sexual relationships, you would be OK with the women who choose to devote themselves to one relationship, as well as those who choose not to, without trying to play off the women in the monogamous relationship as some kind of slaves.

        As it is, this is an insane system that doesn’t work. Divorce rates going up every year, fewer and fewer people getting together in the first place, feminist nuts running around looking for any way to lock a man, or their children, or their relatives down. Honestly, there are ways around that, and places you can go and not have to deal with nutjobs like you, but if a guy want to get off right now, no hassle, no BS, then porn is a better alternative than your average female in this country.

      • JK

        Great. What a ridiculously convoluted way of getting to that point. I’m sure many women feel that porn is better than the average male in this country too. My favourite part of your ridiculous rant was when you said a woman restricts her husband’s sexual options. Yeah, because every man in this country just LOVES it when his wife goes around town sleeping with a different man every night. You’re clearly very bitter about something or someone, I presume she did a real number on you either financially or emotionally. Here’s a tip, get over it and calm down. Watch as much porn as you like, no-one’s going to steal it away from you. Go ahead and wank yourself into a stupor. With any luck, by the time you hit old age, you won’t have to worry about being a sad old man who dies alone.

      • http://touslespoemes.wordpress.com lesort

        Wow, first of all, you’re making vast generalizations about ‘most women’ and the ‘plight of men’ with which I disagree. I’m going to keep this short:

        “With feminism, women demand total sovereignty over their bodies.” You claim that feminism is the problem. Ergo, you’re claiming that women shouldn’t have total control (ownership) when it comes to their bodies. I read your post, and I found it bigoted and ignorant.

        I think some women enjoy turning men on. I do. I genuinely like feeling sexy. And I’m a feminist. The porn industry is generally conducive to the abuse of women, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that all female porn stars are sex slaves.

        Please take a moment to consider the possibility that feminists — and women in general — can be sensitive, reasonable human beings. There’s no such thing as ‘most women,’ just as discussing ‘most men’ misses the point.

        You haven’t found a solution; you’re wrong about the problem. Sorry, but I’m not a nutjob. Self-identified feminists are not necessarily crazy b*tches or lesbians or just plain rude and heartless. I believe we should concern ourselves with people, not the arbitrary, culturally-imposed hero/villain man/woman setup you can’t seem to shake.

      • TUP99

        [Quote]
        Great. What a ridiculously convoluted way of getting to that point. I’m sure many women feel that porn is better than the average male in this country too.[/Quote]

        Don’t care. Good for them. If true then this actually proves my point: porn is a more handy substitute for sexual stimulation than other people.

        [Quote]
        My favourite part of your ridiculous rant was when you said a woman restricts her husband’s sexual options. Yeah, because every man in this country just LOVES it when his wife goes around town sleeping with a different man every night.[/Quote]

        Do people work to have attention spans of 5 seconds and 2 sentences, or is it something most people are born with? The part being referred to here was said in response to a statement saying that the problem with infidelity boils down to what is implied to be an incorrect belief that in a marriage, a male has a belief that a woman doesn’t have unlimited right to do what she pleases with her body while she is in the relationship. Basically I was saying that the idea of people not being 100% sovereign over their bodies in a relationship is not new, nor do women find is as repulsive as they claim, as they invoke the law to restrict men’s sovereignty over their bodies.

        [Quote]You’re clearly very bitter about something or someone, I presume she did a real number on you either financially or emotionally. Here’s a tip, get over it and calm down. Watch as much porn as you like, no-one’s going to steal it away from you. Go ahead and wank yourself into a stupor. With any luck, by the time you hit old age, you won’t have to worry about being a sad old man who dies alone.
        [/Quote]
        …I have a small penis, I fuck sheep, I’m gay, I must be an abuser…nothing new. Typical response from a feminist who runs into a man who knows that there is more to the human experience than what any given woman thinks of him.

        [Quote]
        Wow, first of all, you’re making vast generalizations about ‘most women’ and the ‘plight of men’ with which I disagree. I’m going to keep this short:
        [/Quote]

        Generalizations aren’t necessarily a bad thing, especially when they’re accurate. Most Americans eat beef. More men buy power tools than women. Women spend more money on disposable items than men. Kids get colds more often than adults. Not my fault some generalizations are accurate and unflattering.

        [Quote]
        “With feminism, women demand total sovereignty over their bodies.” You claim that feminism is the problem. Ergo, you’re claiming that women shouldn’t have total control (ownership) when it comes to their bodies. I read your post, and I found it bigoted and ignorant.
        [/Quote]

        Explained it up above, not doing it again. This is what drive the 24hr news cycle we have anymore. Someone gives a speech saying that if we want to drive tax revenues into the ground, and make the populace lose faith in the government, then we should lock up every dark skinned/yellow/purple/long haired/slant eyed/whatever and throw away the key. The next day the reporter and everyone else forgot about the rest of the speech where he was talking about how it wasn’t the best idea and why this wouldn’t work, and remember the 5 second tagline – lock up whoever just because.

        [Quote]
        I think some women enjoy turning men on. I do. I genuinely like feeling sexy. And I’m a feminist. The porn industry is generally conducive to the abuse of women, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that all female porn stars are sex slaves.
        [/Quote]

        Irrelevant to my point.

        [Quote]
        Please take a moment to consider the possibility that feminists — and women in general — can be sensitive, reasonable human beings. There’s no such thing as ‘most women,’ just as discussing ‘most men’ misses the point.

        You haven’t found a solution; you’re wrong about the problem. Sorry, but I’m not a nutjob. Self-identified feminists are not necessarily crazy b*tches or lesbians or just plain rude and heartless. I believe we should concern ourselves with people, not the arbitrary, culturally-imposed hero/villain man/woman setup you can’t seem to shake.[/Quote]

        No I’m not wrong about the problem. If anything, I didn’t go into enough detail about the problem. Bottom line, relationships in this country are screwed up because no one wants to have an honest conversation about them. Marriage contracts aren’t worth the paper they’re printed on, however someone having a series of one night stands can be taken to court and successfully sued for palimony. No one recognizes or discusses open relationships, except to just write off bigamy as illegal. People who don’t even believe in God are wrangling over whether homosexuals can engage in Holy Matrimony (which, once again, isn’t worth the paper it’s printed on or the cost of the wedding reception). And yet somehow, a person is supposed to prefer wading through this mass of people to get off, as opposed to just popping in a DVD and hooking up with a sex toy or whatever if they have one. You know what: if you have a good person available, then yes, that is far better than porn. That said, how many people are good people?

      • Tk

        Seriously, just shut up now. You’re so fucking boring.

  • ktinie

    This is the very reason why everyone, everywhere is reading 50 Shades of Grey.

  • Katja

    I disagree. If I want to indulge in a sexy story, I’ll read erotica or watch a movie that has hot sex scenes. If I want a quick orgasm, I watch porn. I don’t really want a back-story with poor acting – I want to see real sex between real people, which is why I prefer gonzo porn (Rocco is a favourite)

    My only problem with porn is that it is clearly made for men. Personally, I like hardcore porn, and I have a problem with most of the made-for-women “erotica”. First of all, why do we have to call it “erotica”? Why do we have to dress it up with roses and romance instead of just admitting that sometimes, just like the boys, all we want is a quick wank to some dirty porn? Secondly, most porn for women is – in my opinion – too softcore and boring. Why is it assumed that women are only into romantic sex? What if we like watching gangbangs too?

    So I watch regular porn instead. But the problem with that is that it is clearly filmed to please men, especially with the POV scenes. I hate it when I’m just about to cum and the camera shifts to a close-up of some girl fake-moaning as if her life depended on it. Show me the guys’s faces too! And their bodies – penises are great, but there are other hot parts of a man’s body too!

    Luckily there is some porn which is better – Seymore Butts for example, gonzo porn in which the girls are clearly enjoying themselves – and sometimes do the filming themselves for some hot POV action. And of course Rocco, because he is hot and passionate and damn kinky!

  • michaelwg

    Disagree, I just want to see kinky hardcore maneuvers that are guaged on 1-10 Xanax scale. (the number of Xanax the performer must take to make it through the scene)

  • JP

    Kink.com pushes some boundaries.

  • http://touslespoemes.wordpress.com lesort

    ‘lesort’ was me, by the way. I believe in what I wrote enough to put my real name on it.

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